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Original: 2/23/2007 12:07 AM
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Friday, February 23, 2007
 

Now this is stupidity

11:00 p.m. Thursday.....Part of the 147th Air National Guard is flying out of  Ellington Field at midnight tomorrow, in about a dozen F-16's, for an "undisclosed  location in Southeast Asia."  I have no doubt there are brave people in the group. But there are apparently some stupid ones, too. It is such a shame that adults can't just act like mature adults. Instead some have to act like immature little children.  This isn't the first I've heard of such an "award" as this (if you can call it that), but it is wrong.  Humiliating people is  wrong.
 
I know it is suggested as a "cure" for a problem of complaining women.  But I'm going to say something that will sound really harsh to some....those who suggest it are being stupid little boys, rather than grown-up men. And this was carrying it way to far. It goes hand-in-hand with some men only thinking in a sexual nature.  More than once, I've heard men say (or know it was said to someone) that, "Her problem is she just needs to get laid." Yeah. ...that'll solve everything.  (That was even said to a woman at our church, when she was grieving over the death of her husband. No...it was not a church member that said it to her.)
 
And for the record, no....I don't think all men think like that. That would be equally demeaning in the other direction.

No doubt there will be men (maybe some I know) complaining about these women making this subject public. But unfortunately, the squeaky wheel doesn't get the grease unless you turn it into a really big squeaky wheel.


Is the Texas Air Guard shooting down women's careers? 

10:00 PM CST on Thursday, February 22, 2007, Mark Greenblatt - 11 News Investigates
They’re decorated military officers who have protected our country, so why do they claim the military is forcing them out?
They say it’s because they’re women.
That’s what 11 News Investigates has found might be happening in the Texas Air National Guard with more about a possible sex discrimination scandal in the making.
 
They’re trained, they’ve served and some have even fought protecting our country. Now all these women in the Texas Air National Guard say they want to know is why they’re being humiliated and pushed out by their male commanders.
As long as she can remember, service was the most important thing in Adrion Bell’s family. “My grandfather was in for 42 years,” Bell said. “My dad was in for 23.”
 
So she enlisted with the Texas Air National Guard, and one day she was invited to a mostly male leadership camp.  “It’s the transition from being a follower to a leader,” she said.
 
But what she saw happen to a fellow female airman has shaken her belief in the Texas Guard. “I guess they found her too outspoken,” Bell said. “I can’t believe they’re doing this.”
 
“This” was the Vagisil award: a foam tiara with the Vagisil product label pasted on it. It was given by a group of instructors who forced the young woman to wear it.
 
“All three of them lined up in front of her, bowed down onto one knee in front of her as you would royalty, and presented her with a tube of Vagisil,” Bell said.
So why the so-called award? The military leader in charge of the camp joined the ceremony, announcing that the young woman “whined and bitched about everything,” Bell said.
 
Bell said the effect was devastating. “When we got back to our room she was crying, physically ill,” she said. And to this day, it angers her.  “I was very offended,” Bell said.
 
Women in service. They train, they fight and sometimes die to protect their country. But 11 Investigates has found that in the Texas Air National Guard, instead of honoring these soldiers, a mostly male leadership may be simply driving them out.
 
Meet Col. Sue Hechinger. She was at Ellington Field when her country asked her to volunteer for duty in Iraq.
 
“I was a wing commander in a wartime environment,” Col. Hechinger said. She helped lead America’s air and troop movements there and got the Bronze Star.
“We did the mission,” she said. “We saved lives.”
 
But when she returned to Ellington and the Texas Guard, a boss she had met twice – Col. Lanny McNeely -- actually complained about her absence in an evaluation saying she left “the mission support group adrift during her long absence.” 
 
11 News: “And what is the effect of that piece of paper?”
SH: “It’s a career killer.”
11 News: “So someone who has met you two times …”
SH: “Correct.”
11 News: “ … is all of a sudden evaluating you with a horrible performance report.”
SH: “Correct.”
11 News: “While all the while you are overseas?”
SH: “Correct.”
11 News: “Serving your country?”  
SH: “Uh-huh.”
 
Rita Goudeau served for 33 years. “I’m hurt, and I’m angry,” she said.
 
And with two master’s degrees and three national awards, she was the top recruiter in the nation. But she said officers like McNeely had a problem with diversity.
 
RG: “He went as far as to tell me he didn’t want me to use that word in his presence.”
11 News: “Diversity?”
RG: “Diversity was something he didn’t like. He didn’t believe in it, and don’t use that around him.”
 
But Goudeau said it didn’t surprise her. “If you look at the stats, you will see — it is blatant,” she said.
 
And indeed, a report from the National Guard shows at Ellington, five colonels run the base. And underneath them? Twenty-four lieutenant colonels. Twenty-eight are men. That leaves one woman. But it turns out she’s part of a joint congressional complaint about events at the base alleging “discrimination” and the “relegation of females to second-class citizens.”
 
As for Goudeau, she said she too was driven out and is now a part of that congressional complaint.
 
“I tell you if I were a senior airman, I would be thinking twice before I put in a complaint in the Texas Air National Guard,” Col. Jill Collins said. “They’re not ever going to promote them or they’re going to demote them.
That’s called retaliation,” she said.
 
Collins investigated discrimination complaints and was part of the senior leadership team at guard headquarters and said little has changed.
“The cases I investigated 10, 20 years ago are still happening today,” Col. Collins said.
 
Part of the problem? She says there is a resistance to change. “Women are a very big part of our fighting forces, and it’s about time they stop being discounted and discredited,” Col. Collins said.
 
Meet Gen. Charles Rodriguez, the head of the guard.
 
11 News: “One airman was given this tiara to wear and awarded the Vagisil award. In your estimation, is this OK in today’s Guard?”
CR: “Anything that would demean an individual upon investigation will be dealt with very severely. Your statement is informative and helpful.”
But what about the lack of women leaders?
11 News: “Not a single female has ever been brought before the board to be considered for the position of general on the air Guard side.”
CR: “In order to be considered for general there are certain requirements to include schooling and to include command time.”
 
So what about Col. Hechinger? America’s top two air force generals in the Iraq war called her “an exceptional leader,” “extraordinary diplomat,” “consummate war fighter “and an “exceptional team builder.”
 
11 News: “What is it about those kinds of qualifications that might not qualify her to be brought before a board and considered?”
CR: “She’s a qualified air force officer.”
11 News: “But she was never brought before a board to be considered for the position of general?”
CR: “At this point what I’d like to do is let you know another consideration in addition to schooling and experience is performance, and I will stop there.”
11 News: “She’s a Bronze Star winner.”
CR: “I will stop there.”
 
But in the end, it all leaves women like Goudeau feeling dismissed. “It’s the culture of the Air National Guard,” Goudeau said.
 
The Guard said apparently, this wasn’t the first time “the Vagisil award” was given out but said it will be the last, calling the whole incident “deplorable.”
They said several senior instructors have already been reprimanded.
But as for that congressional complaint? Gen. Rodriguez said he’s ordered a formal investigation to begin and has asked a female general from outside Texas to lead it. 
  TRIPLES with EMMA
 Posted 2/23/2007 12:07 AM - 2 views - 16 comments

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16 Comments

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:(I don't see discrimination ever ending.. I think it will always be there because of narrow minded, dim witted people.. sad, very sad...

Hope your Friday is a great day... I had to turn the air on for a little while today, was getting a little stuffy in the house...

Hugs!!

Posted 2/23/2007 12:20 AM by daisymae81 Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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Hi, Thank you for sharing this horrible story. :mad:I can personally say I had hoped “things” have changed but obviously not. Yes, I had horrible problems but fortunately I always seem to have a guardian angel that kinda watched out for me. Sometimes I was basically told that hey that’s just the way he is--it took several years but after I had gotten out of the Army National Guard several of these “just the way he is” officer’s got in serious trouble. They basically got kicked out of the service (no benefits) and fined. Please have a great weekend, Sharon in Athens
Posted 2/23/2007 12:22 AM by justhopingnow Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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I know ladies......that kind of stuff makes me angry. It's just completely uncalled for. And the humiliation these people are trying to put on these women, and even on other men, just comes from hatred. It's "the way it is," but it should not be. Fortunately, the day is coming when God is the only one who will decide what is just.

Connie, we turned the air on yesterday. Of course, there have been days even in January where we had to run it at least for a few hours. The price of living in Texas :rolleyes:

Posted 2/23/2007 1:23 AM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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My husband's cousin, M, is an Army helicopter pilot serving in Iraq.  As far as I know SHE has not been humiliated like this.  And she's in the First Cavalry!

I personally would not serve in the military.  But the women who do shouldn't be hazed, humiliated, discriminated against or denied promotion for the fact that they are women. 

This stinks.

Posted 2/23/2007 9:56 AM by carrensey - reply

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I'm all for women's equality... but I CANNOT STAND the women who expect special treatment simply BECAUSE they are women. Gimme a break. Obviously, that's not what your article is about, but I see that kind of crap a lot. Especially in school and it pisses me off.
Posted 2/23/2007 11:48 AM by AKA_PawPrinter - reply

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I agree, Lauryn. Steve use to work with a woman who had the same title and was in the same pay range as he was, but expected him to help her with stuff she couldn't do - lifting heavy stuff, etc. I think if a woman wants the same job and same pay, she should have to prove she can do all the same work.
Posted 2/23/2007 12:01 PM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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So?  I don't get the big deal if it was true.  If they were whining, I wouldn't expect any less from people in the military.  They need to get over themselves.  If women ever want equality, they need to quit thinking it's all about them, and their feelings.  It's not about THEM specifically, but their actions.  Your actions make you who you are, you want to change who you are? change your actions.  If you don't change, someone's gonna come along and help you change.  Get over yourself.  You don't think things like this happen to males?  They do, all the time.  It's funny, and it teaches a lesson pretty freakin quick.  How do you find out how people react under the stress of combat w/o actually putting them in combat?  Give 'em brain fire.  Stress them out so bad the want to cry, and then ask them to perform their job.  Then you find out if they can handle doing it for real.  Then you find out if they're cut out to do the job.  Anyone can do something under clinical conditions.  But when you're in the middle of the poop, that's what counts.  If you can't take a joke (and the meaning behind it) why should I think you can take the riggors of combat.  (this is an equal opportunity rant btw, just seems that this sort of thing gets reported by minorities more)

Did the Texas Air Guard shoot anything down?  No, except some whiny people who don't understand that their whole purpose in life is to kill people and break things, or support those who do.  Either way, whining isn't tolerated.  If I say, "stop whining" it isn't all that effective.  If I hand you a bottle of vagisil and tell you to clean the sand out, you'll get the point really quick and shut up.  I highly suspect that the rigors of the course were equally distributed amongst participants, some took it upon themselves to cry about it.  They singled THEMSELVES out far before the instructors did anything.

They signed up to be a part of a war-fighting organization.  A male-dominated (3 out of 4 Air Force members are male) war-fighting organization.  Emotional distress is NOT hazing.  Physical distress is.  I've been subjected to many smoke sessions and have had many rediculous stunts demanded of me because of stupid things I did.  It's part of being in the military.  It's part of being molded into a team.  It's part of the way militaries around the world have been operating for centuries.

As far as that colonel goes.  Can't say much b/c there's only one side to the story.  There is MUCH more that goes into promotions than simply numbers.  What specialty are they in? How many others are in that track this year?  What has congress authorized?  A BSM (bronze star medal) doesn't mean anything anymore at those ranks.  Maj, LtCol, and Col get them almost guaranteed after a tour in the desert (that's another rant for another time)  OPRs (evaluations) are a big part of the promotion process as well, and that comment mentioned could be rather damaging, but I highly doubt it had anything to do with the actual deployment time, in fact deployment time is a plus (means you're doing your job instead of sitting on your kiester).

So, do I have a problem with diversity?  in theory and principle, no.  In reality? YES.  It requires an even playing field... below that standard set already.  Women want equal rights?  They can start by being held to the same PT standards I am.  They can start by not avoiding manual labor.  They can start by being part of the team.

Posted 2/23/2007 11:38 PM by etool_deux - reply

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Oooo......I knew that post was going to hit a nerve. And I was pretty sure it would be yours.

I agree with you about women being held to the same standards........if they want to be able to do the same thing, they should have to pass the same standards. I absolutely have no problem with that. I do have a real problem with women genuinely whining about not getting equal equal pay or equal perks, without having to do equal work.

And I don't have any problem with women being reprimanded for doing something stupid. I also do think there are a lot of wrong things done to men. It just happens that this article is about women. The thing that wasn't made public here is what they were "whining" about. It wasn't about being promoted....it was something else. The point from the interview that was on tv (this article is just a transcript of part of the interview) is that the superiors were trying to find reasons to make the women quit before they ever reached a level such as general.

However, I don't think that anything should turn into something sexual in nature, as this is. I don't think demeaning women because they are women is right, anymore than I would agree with you being demeaned because you are Korean, or male, or any other thing that is something you can't help.

Love you, Sweetie.

Posted 2/24/2007 12:45 AM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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I don't understand how McNeely could even have the nerve to complain - in an evaluation of her performance - about Heckinger being deployed. That seems stupid.

But I'm still on the old fashioned side......I still don't even like the idea of women being in combat situations at all, for the very reason that women are not as capable of a lot of things that men are capable of.

Posted 2/24/2007 2:51 AM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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I've been thinking about how to more clearly explain what I am thinking, and I guess I didn't do a really good job of that.

This "award" or even referring to the product at all in the setting that was described, is humiliating to a woman, nearly as much as it would be to be forced to stand naked in front of those men. It is as if the men are making fun of the very body parts themselves. It would be just as humiliating for a man to have to stand there with women laughing at him in reference to body parts. That's just way too personal.

Women are made fun of just because of things like body functions. If women complain about anything, men chalk it up to PMS. And it's worse if his buddies are all sympathizing with him. We don't like being made fun of because we are women or because we have certain body functions. Men make stupid complaints, too, but there is nothing as personal that he is made fun of for. He isn't made fun of simply because he is a man. We, as women, might think, "He's really in a bad mood," but we don't chalk it up to some bodily function he has no control over.

Maybe that can kind of give you a better idea of what it would be like for a woman.

Posted 2/24/2007 4:34 AM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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I know it's demeaning... that's the whole point.  Thick skin.  Take the point and be happy they didn't do anything worse... like freeze the compainers out.  It has NOTHING to do with their gender.  They may THINK it did, but it didn't.  Going off half the story is rather difficult to argue as well. 
Posted 2/24/2007 10:39 AM by etool_deux - reply

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Well, it's just something that we will have to agree to disagree on. I do see the "point" in demeaning them (I know what it's supposed to accomplish).

Here's a thought, though, that bothers me. Men who treat women like that in the military, will have a tendency to treat them that way, even not in the military. If that is a man's habit or training, he's likely to carry it over into the other parts of his life. And I know that you know that military thinking does invade the rest of your life.

Don't be afraid to say whatever you are thinking (within reason) here. At this point, it will probably only be you and me that will see these comments.

On a different note, I wish I could tell you all about Beth and the girl from church who is having some problems. I'm glad this girl got caught now, before she really screwed up her life.

Posted 2/24/2007 1:06 PM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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:wink: Just had another thought......(hush...I heard that:nono: ).....I can guarantee that from now on when you go to say that to someone, you will think about our discussion. :heartbeat:
Posted 2/24/2007 1:17 PM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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compartmentalize it all... work is work... home is home.  personally I wouldn't go so far as to buy a bottle of vagisil, I can give a pretty good tounge lashing when I need  to.  (learned from some of the best Marine and Army NCOs!!  That and I would have to spend my own money on someone elses stupidity, and we all know how I feel about that)  But I don't do those things at home.  Plus I'm smart enough to realize (and I'd wager most other NCOs are too) when a complaint is legit and when it's a bunch of BS.  Anyway, the military culture and the warrior ethos is slowly dying, and I regret to see it happening.  Some people say that you don't have to be as hard on X, Y or Z troops because the PROBABLY will never see combat.  Then Afghanistan happend.  They said it was ok to relax standards, then Iraq happened.  Most police officers will never fire their weapon or be fired upon in anger, but does that mean they should relax their mentality?  No, of course not.  It's no less true with the warrior mentality.  You don't know what your next deployment holds, where you will go, what the situation will be.  And if it's a bad one, that's not the time to toughen up. 
Posted 2/24/2007 8:03 PM by etool_deux - reply

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Hi, again, Cutie. Sorry I didn't see this sooner. I've been lost in what use to be Brandon's room :rolleyes:

I just think that being tough and strict on those in your command, doesn't have to include that kind of humiliation. I know it would be tempting, though, as I am not a patient person. I have a hard time with the stupidity of others. You've "heard" me talk about the ex-Marine that works for Steve now. He has told some pretty stupid things that were said to him, not to keep him in line or discipline him, but just to be insulting. I won't go into the whole story, but he tried to get time off to come home for his grandmother's funeral, and there were some really stupid things said to him, um...let's just say, insulting the moral integrity of his grandmother. His favorite line is, "He's an idiot."

And it's a good thing I am not a police officer. There would probably be a lot of dead people, and I'd be in trouble. :lookaround:

Posted 2/24/2007 10:31 PM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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I enjoy our discussions, even when we disagree on things. Miss you.
Posted 2/27/2007 11:47 AM by SingingMom Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply


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