buddhagazellehic est prolationem latinam insignificantem,
huc locatam ad se iactandum solum.
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Original: 8/25/2007 11:59 PM
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Saturday, August 25, 2007

snark and lewis wannabes

 Keep thinking I have things to write.

Went to a "debate" tonight-- big auditorium, standing-room only.  However those folks publicize, I need to take a page from their book.  It was put on by the Gator Freethought Society and a new little breakaway Anglican parish.  The "debate" featured two Anglicans-- an Episcopalian atheist, and a Church of England apologist, on the topic "Is Christianity Based on a Lie?"

Both articulate folks, both used the jargon of their own worlds to preach to their respective choirs.  Wasn't so much of a debate as it was two cheerfests at the same time & place.  In the Q & A session, the only really bright and challenging question came from a Muslim kid and neither Green nor Price had a meaningful response.  Green quoted C. S. Lewis to Lewis addicts, and Price made sarcastic jokes about fundamentalists-- both got about equal amounts of applause from their respective camps.  And they both went on and on about Aristotle and "the classics" and "the ancient world" and all that other Romish imperialistic hogwash.

Can't say that there was a winner-- each speaker sloganeered to his base and did so with wit and skill.  The Anglican apologist had the advantage of an Oxfordian accent, while the Episcopalian atheist was straight-up American.  The Muslim kid with the good question pointed out that neither of them addressed anything close to the issues someone with his point of view would raise.

It was fun-- nice to hear skilled speakers speaking skillfully.  Sure attracted a mighty crowd... but I'm not sure I do feel the point of it.  From either point of view, it wasn't really evangelism, it wasn't really worship, and it certainly wasn't focused on God.  It was smart people getting together to feel smug about our collective smartness and to make wisecracks about the other guy.
 Posted 8/25/2007 11:59 PM - 6 views - 10 comments

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Visit sonnetjoy's Xanga Site!
That makes me sad. What was the Muslim's question?
Posted 8/26/2007 11:51 AM by sonnetjoy Xanga True Member - reply

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i've never liked offical debates. they don't seem to get anyone anywhere. each side is so busy thinking of their own argument, that there's no actual listening and learning.
Posted 8/26/2007 12:01 PM by ginsomanye - reply

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I'm interested in the Muslim's question, too. 
Posted 8/26/2007 12:45 PM by TamaraMamma Xanga True Member - reply

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It was, more or less what I said-- "One of you is saying that Christianity is true; the other that all religious belief is folly. What would you say to the belief, held by Muslims, that Christianity at its origins was good and true but later became corrupted?"
Posted 8/26/2007 10:32 PM by buddha_gazelle Xanga True Member - reply

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How was the man an episcopalian atheist?  Did he deconvert from being an episcopal? 

Have you read Blue Like Jazz?  Donald Miller resounds your views on debate about God; here is the excerpt from the book:

"My most recent faith struggle is not one of intellect. I don't really do that anymore. Sooner or later you just figure out there are some guys who don't believe in God and they can prove He doesn't exist, and some other guys who do believe in God and they can prove He does exist, and the argument stopped being about God a long time ago and now it's about who is smarter, and honestly I don't care."

However, have you ever read any debates of William Lane Craig?  He always shares his testimony at the end, and apparently people actually come to Christ as a result of his debates. 

Best to ya!

Posted 8/28/2007 4:41 AM by StrokeofThought Xanga True Member Xanga Premium Member - reply

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I, too, want to know what an Episcopalian atheist is. 
Posted 8/28/2007 8:30 AM by Prophetmargin - reply

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He's an outspoken atheist who is a faithful communicant in the Episcopal church. He became an Episcopalian because they didn't mind if he didn't believe in God.
Posted 8/28/2007 11:07 AM by buddha_gazelle Xanga True Member - reply

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So that was the question. And the debate was in Britain?

Perhaps there was strong motivation for not wanting to answer that question fully.

Meh. I'm not up for these type of debates either. Too much talk, not enough listening. I've never seen one end with either guy saying "oh, man, I think you've changed my mind!"  So, there you go.

Posted 8/29/2007 12:45 PM by Cymrugirl - reply

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naw, the debate was here at UF. One of the speakers was a Brit. And both speakers generally answered most of the questions poorly-- rather, they evaded the questions and just repeated their talking points.
Posted 8/29/2007 12:47 PM by buddha_gazelle Xanga True Member - reply

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It's college - you expected different?

I did like the Blue Like Jazz quote.  One thing I always think should be notable to anyone who demeans the opposite point of view is to understand that there are certainly people on the other side who know more than them, have studied this longer than them, are smarter than them, and still disagree with them.  If you honestly realize that, it gets a little harder to be such a jerk on the intellectual issues.

Posted 9/6/2007 12:08 AM by dankster312 - reply


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