Sunday, April 13, 2008
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Ben Stein's movie
"Instead of a cosmic mistake, he says the evidence seems to indicate that we are the product of a higher intelligence."
Only have seen this trailer. But from what I can see this looks worth seeing.
UPDATE: Click here to go to the movie website. The flash intro is pretty amusing with Ben Stein doing his best Angus Young impersonation.
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Comments (26)
interesting!
This movie is opening nationwide on April 18th. Boy am I going to see it! Even if I have to go alone. What really irked me were those "scientists"! And isn't Kathleen Kennedy Townsend part of the "faithful Kennedy" clan? Her comment on this clip about Creationists and how they're "distracting you from what's important." :ssmad: If her hair was longer? I'd pull her pigtails...lol. But seriously, thanks for posting this and letting me know about it. I'm going opening night.
I have a deal for you...I'll get the game tickets if you can get up here. Whatcha say? Bring the boys, bring Jenna, you can even bring Shadow but you'll have to diguise him as a service dog to get him in :sswink:. I'll talk to you more about it later. Take care!
I plan on seeing that. Thanks for posting the trailer.
P.S. When doing a search for movies and tickets on opening day? I'm not showing anything within 10 miles of my house, but it's playing at the Fox Tower 10 by yours. Still searching. If you see it first, you'll definitely have to post on it k? Cya!
P.S.S.S.S.S.S.S.
Found one in Redmond......
I will probably seeing this movie, alone, when it eventually gets here -but on your recommendation I will put aside the humiliation and endeavor to go and watch it anyway - LOL!
RYC : Thank you for your awesome words - you're very special to me!
I'm excited about this movie. . . . more so since reading Time's biased review. It was typical intelligentsia response - poopoo the whole thing without actually refuting anything.
Obviously, I don't endorse this film, but if you must go, see my current post, read the links provided, and go in aware of what the scientific community feels about this film and ID in general - not out of fear or because a conspiracy exists, but because ID's claims are simply wrong, not to mention unscientific. Indeed, if a scientist could ever present conclusive, testable, peer-reviewed evidence that an organism could not exist through natural means would be collecting awards and accolades, not threatened and pushed into a corner. I've always found it funny that as society changes and evidence is better known, creationism has always mutated and evolved into separate branches (Young earth, old earth, theistic evolution, intelligent design), making itself a perfect cultural equivalent of the theory it rejects.
"What really irked me were those 'scientists'!"
Why put the word 'scientists' in quotes? Each of them has an abundance of knowledge and understanding of their field that would take you or I a decade or more of intensive study to match. It's not surprising that they would take issue with a baseless, nonscientific idea that undermines science education, yet is gaining strongholds by appealing to people's religious proclivities. But why would you be irked by that? Is it because they are not telling you what you want to hear?
Science is theory and not fact. Why spend a decade wasting your time when there is a centuries old book called the bible that has all the proof in the world?
@filow84 - Thanks for the comment. I will go see it and yes I must go as I desire to gather ideas from all possible sources. I will admit that I'm not open minded on the issue. I have reasonable bases for my position which I think is close to the position of this film.
"What really irked me were those 'scientists'!
Where did this come from? I didn't say it so I'm kind of mystified.
But I would agree in part that many scientists possess credentials I couldn't come close to matching. But when it comes to origins of species scientists have about as much evidence (and actual observation) as I do. It's when scientists start making claims that venture into the areas of faith that they stop being scientists and start being religionists. And this may be true of creationists too. At least creationists are at least willing to cede there may be a faith aspect that lies outside realm of science.
But credentials or not, a sacred cow, to use a biblical metaphor (sorry) can be made out of anything...even science.
@efarns -
I would like to know your thoughts when you've seen it.
@followfreedom - "Where did this come from? I didn't say it so I'm kind of mystified."
I was responding to triciaplumley's comment. Sorry I didn't make that clear.
"But when it comes to origins of species scientists have about as much evidence (and actual observation) as I do."
That's simply not true. Overwhelming evidence from varying fields such as paleontology, microbiology, embryology, comparative anatomy, genetics and others all converge to the point that all organisms on earth are the result of billions of years of evolution from a common ancestor. Rather than going into this at length, I'll direct you to this book, which is probably available at most public libraries. It's one of the better comprehensive books on evolution I can think of, though I wish he had spent more time on reptiles.
"It's when scientists start making claims that venture into the areas of faith that they stop being scientists and start being religionists."
I'd like to address this, but I'm not sure which claims you had in mind.
" a sacred cow, to use a biblical metaphor (sorry) can be made out of anything...even science."
There are no sacred truths in science. Everything is eligible and open to scrutiny, further experimentation, rebuttal, or reversal. But it has to be done the right way. There is an unbelievable gauntlet of tests and confirmation that all scientific ideas and discoveries must go through long before they can reach textbooks and classrooms, and ID is at this point unable and unwilling to pass this test. ID has not been expelled; it has flunked.
@triciaplumley - Science is a process of obtaining knowledge through a cycle of making objective obervations, performing experiments, forming hypotheses, and repeating. This results in an accumulation of independently verified facts that form theories and laws used to explain naturally occuring phenomena. Over the last century, hundreds of diverse, well-developed disciplines have formed, each consisting of countless hard-working individuals working diligently and anonymously toward the betterment of humanity. It has been the most useful and successful way of understanding the universe we have ever had. It has allowed us to explore and view the corners of the cosmos, shown us the microscopic world inside all things, and more than doubled our life expectancy - and that's just the last 200 years - not to mention providid creature comforts such as the computer I am typing on and the electricity it requires. Needless to say, it is not a waste of time.
I doubt that most theologians would recommend using the bible as a scientific text. While it is believed to be a written account of God and Jesus' interactions with people 2000 years ago and the handbook for living within the boundaries of major religions, it is hardly a reference guide for the workings of the natural universe. In the few times it ventured into that area, it was shown to be colossally wrong.
Show me where it's wrong
@John, he's referring to my comment about the idiots on the trailer to the movie ;)...lol
@ filow84.....If there is no God, ultimately, philosophically, how can one talk about reality? How can one even rationally believe that there is such a thing as truth, let alone decide what it is?
Thank you for being you : for being intelligent, funny, inspirational and such an encouragement! I thank God daily for someone like you in my life! Have a wonderful week! :sswink:
"There are no sacred truths in science."
I am no scientist. But my sense is that this is true more in theory than in practice. No doubt that there are dedicated scientists who follow protocols and in due time we are benefitted by their work. But knowing human nature which science can't and has never claimed (to my knowledge) to be able to change, even scientists can be prone to hold to outdated ideas and exalt ones that are thin on the evidence If this is not true then that puts scientists and other "intelligentsia" in another class of humans and... well that's another story.@filow84 -
I really want to see this movie. The fact that the hubby will be on his three and two schedule means he will miss when this movie opens. He will also miss when Narnia's Prince Caspian opens as well. So there are two movies we want to go see as a family that may have to wait for his return but I'm afraid that Ben's will leave after being released for three weeks which is how long it takes for the hubby to get home. I think that how long it stays in the theatre is dependent on those box office bucks. I read the review for Ben's movie at PluggedInOnline and decided I wanted to see it. Some of Ben's "off the record" remarks are in that review when it comes to his religious view of whether or not the thinks we were created by God.
Are you going to the movie Friday? I want someone to discuss it with :ssgoofywink:
@triciaplumley -
"Show me where it's wrong."
This is a good start.
"If there is no God, ultimately, philosophically, how can one talk about reality? How can one even rationally believe that there is such a thing as truth, let alone decide what it is?"
Firstly, I never postulated that there is no god. It is entirely possible to believe in a god of some sort while accepting the theory of evolution; this is called theistic evolution and is increasingly popular, though I personally don't subscribe to it. Secondly, I'm not quite sure what you're asking, but I'll do my best to respond. Talking about reality and accepting or seeking truth is best done through our basic senses. Looking, listening, measuring, testing, observing, and thinking will lead us to better understanding. Is it possible that all that we think, feel, and experience isn't real, and therefore, we have no idea what it real or true? I suppose. But thus far, there is no evidence, and therefore no reason, to believe as such. We have no choice but to go by what the best evidence tells us. We can only grow the way the wind blows.
John, it is easy to leave you nice comments, you're one of the nice guys! I hope you are having a good week - so ARE you going to the movie on Friday - Trish wants to talk about it - LOL! I'll discuss it with you guys in about SIX MONTHS TIME, when it finally makes its debut on our big screens! :ssgoofywink:
ROFL! Wish you lived in Washington state Megan...even Oregon. I'd come drive you and the kids to see it with me.
You must be out buying a Chapman Stick
@triciaplumley - Nope. They're about 2000 - 2500. :ssboohoo: