haha, thanks a lot for the comment. i should definitely work on my isues...maybe i should write poetry. that's healthy. see ya at the cafe.

Here's something I cut and paste that perhaps states some of the issues more clearly. I'm going to start inviting people to my "progressive dispensationalism" blogring, if it sounds interesting, feel free to join. It's for anyone really that's curious ;)

PROBLEMS OF TRADITIONAL DISPENSATIONALISM RESOLVED IN PROGRESSIVE DISPENSATIONALISM
Major Problem #1 Old Testament Prophecy applied to the Church by New Testament writers.
If the present dispensation is a 'parenthesis' in God's plan for Israel, and the Church is not related to OT prophecy, we would not expect New Testament writers to apply Old Testament prophecy to the Church. Yet, there are many examples of this very thing. The most obvious example is the Day of Pentecost, where Peter interpreted the coming of the Holy Spirit on the Church as the direct fulfillment of Joel 2:28-32. Notice, Peter said, "this IS that which was spoken by the prophet Joel." [Acts 2:15-21]. Peter's application of Joel fits right in with Progressive Dispensationalism. A few other noteworthy cases of Old Testament prophecy directly applied to the Church, are as follows: Acts 10:43, Acts 15:14-18, Rom. 1:1,2, Rom. 4:13-17,23,24, Rom. 9:32,33, Rom. 15:4,8-10, 2 Cor. 6:16-7:1.

Major Problem #2 The New Covenant, promised to Israel, is now in force.
Paul wrote to the church in Corinth regarding their observance of the Lord's Supper, as a reminder of Jesus' establishment of the New Covenant. "In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me." For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord's death till He comes." [1 Cor 11:25-26]. This would hardly be appropriate had the New Covenant not been inaugurated, or if it applied exclusively to physical Israel. Paul also saw himself as having a role in the spread of the New Covenant among the Gentiles. "Who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant." [2 Cor. 3:6]. Jesus was the "mediator of a better covenant, which was established [past tense] on better promises" [Heb. 8:6-13]. The writer then quoted Jeremiah 31:31-34 and applied the prophecy of the New Covenant to the Church. This is not to say that everything related to the New Covenant has been completely fulfilled. Jeremiah's prophecy said "after those days ... all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them." The universal acceptance of the New Covenant by Israel will only occur after the partial blindness is removed. With the Mosaic Covenant, most of the promises and benefits pertained to their dwelling in the 'promised land.' Yet, these promises were not realized by the very generation who received them! For more than 40 years they wandered in the wilderness. Does this mean the Covenant made at Mt Sinai was suspended while they wandered in the wilderness? No! They simply had to wait until they reached Canaan before they could enjoy the full benefits of this covenant put into place at Mt. Sinai. The same is true of Israel under the New Covenant. The 'promised land' of the New Covenant is the Millennial Kingdom.

Major problem #3 God Continues to Deal with Israel in this Dispensation.
Certain things have and are occurring in Israel's history since the Day of Pentecost that are the direct fulfillment of prophecy. This makes the traditional dispensational 'parenthetical' theory untenable.
a. The destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70 was the direct fulfillment of Daniel 9:26.
b. The regathering of Israel into their land is the likely fulfillment of Ezekiel 37.
c. God is also using the salvation of the Gentiles to provoke (unbelieving) Israel to jealousy. [Rom. 10:18,19 & 11:11].

Major Problem #4 Only a Remnant of Old Testament Israel is Saved.
Dispensationalists speak of "Israel" and the "Church" as two distinct peoples of God. While all true members of the "Church" are saved, and will be resurrected at the resurrection of the just, this is not the case with Israel. Traditional Dispensationalists are comparing apples to oranges here, when they refer to two different peoples of God. Israel is a "nation," not a spiritual entity. Dispensationalists fail to address the fact that the Old Testament promises to Israel will be fulfilled literally in the Millennium, but ONLY by the righteous remnant who are raised at the resurrection of the Just. [Daniel 12:1-3,13, Mal. 3:16 - 4:3, Rom. 11:2-5]. Most of Israel is lost. This has been true throughout their entire history. The unfaithful majority of Israel will not be resurrected or inherit anything in the Kingdom. Dispensationalists speak of "Israel" as a nation, yet they fail to clearly distinguish the believers from the unbelievers within Israel. Consequently, they speak of the Old Testament promises being fulfilled for "Israel" in the Millennium, yet imply that this is merely all the Jews still alive after the tribulation. They have forgotten about all of the saints of Hebrews 11 from the Old Testament, who will receive the literal fulfillment of those promises to Israel in the Millennium, in resurrected bodies.

Progressive dispensationalists have simply taken this fact to its logical conclusion. Jews saved after Christ are still as much "Jews" as are the patriarchs, and will still partake of the promises along with the patriarchs, in resurrected bodies. All saints make up the "Church." Yet, Jewish believers have special promises from the Old Testament that are not cancelled for them just because they happen to live after Pentecost.
Progressive dispensationalism maintains the distinction between Israel and the Church, not by segregating them into two separate "peoples of God." But, by nationality, and recognizing that one group is merely a nation, and the other a spiritual entity. Israel is a nation made up of believers and unbelievers. The Church is a spiritual organism made up of the remnant of Jewish believers and the remnant of Gentile believers. Consequently, we have three entities - the Jews, the Gentiles, and the Church of God - the Church having members from both groups. The Jewish Millennial inheritance will be realized by the Jewish members of the Church. And the general promises of inheritance will be realized by the whole Church.

Major Problem #5 Multiple Plans of Salvation
Many traditional dispensationalists have devised different plans of salvation for Israel and the Church. Pre-tribulationists usually claim that during the tribulation, the plan of salvation will incorporate the Old Covenant in some way. Salvation for the Old Testament saints is seen as having to do with works along with faith. Progressive dispensationalists see only one means of eternal salvation, through the blood of Christ. All saints are united in Christ by the blood of Christ, regardless of whether they lived before or after the cross. Animal sacrifices "could never take away sin." For the Old Testament saints who died in faith, Jesus' blood sacrifice is retroactive for them, to purchase eternal redemption for them after the fact. Hence, Paul, in Hebrews nine proclaims, "And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance." (Heb. 9:15). And after giving a list of some of these people of faith from the Old Testament, he writes, "And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise, God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us." (Heb. 11:39,40). Eternal redemption and the promise of eternal inheritance comes only through the blood of Christ via. the New Covenant. Old Testament saints are brought into the New Covenant, and made complete along with us.

Also I've written a few things here:

(be prepared for some very long winded articles, LOL)

I like your poem!

ryc: Thank you for your well thought out and well written response to my question I asked! I agree with what you wrote!

Blessings to you! - By the way, you don't ever have to apologize for leaving too long of a msg, everything you typed was well worth the read!

God Bless! - Kerrie

I enjoy your poetry my brother. Thanks for your support and reply . Do you subscribe to Desiring God ? They keep me updated on John Pipers teachings by email . The latest is titled ---

Jim try to follow their conference

http://www.desiringgod.org/news_events/dgm_national/2006/index.html

Got to go ,

Barry

Thanks for the support. I'd be posting it one of these days.

Perhaps I should write a poem from time to time.

ROTC camp, it may not happen, due to scheduling problems (it was going to be our own thing, but before that it was run by higher command at Camp Shelby, and involved multiple Battalions.) I've been great!, Neal is home, and I got a 5 out of 5 on the National AP US history exam. How have you been?

neat.

Thanks for your comments about Ray Comfort's tracts, I agree they are awesome.  Yes, I did show our youth at Mid week service that video and they really liked it...glad you are using that material....May God Continue to Bless You!!

Mike

that was really awesome! are you overseas now? it's just it looks like you're in the military... so i was curious... thought i'd stop by *since i saw you visited*

have a great rest of the week,
~alysa

wow! you've been to a lot of places.. my huband *who was my boyfriend at the time* was in Iraq from Jan 2004 to Jan 2005... how was your time over in those places?

~alysa